SO WHY NOT ME ?

[ostmike]

You’re getting some good info to consider. Hellcats have always had a problem getting off the line at the track. It’s the nature of the beast. That’s why we’ve all suffered thru the Utube videos of them getting beat by every underpowered POS you can imagine. A lot of that is inexperienced drivers that don’t understand what they need to do. The other part just comes down to tires that are not capable of doing the job. That will include any tire on a 20” wheel. The mid to low 10 second passes you are seeing are usually getting done with a more serious drag tire like the M/T-R drag radial on a 17 or 18 inch wheel. Put some of those on there and you’ll knock .3 seconds off that 60 ft. That will be worth 4 to 5 tenths at the end of the track. Another thing.... your mph is down. The most likely reason for that is the computer is pulling timing. There are a number of things that can cause that. Your PCM is a nanny. She is watching over everything and will do what is necessary to keep all the parts safe. If your fuel is a little low on octane, back comes the timing. Make sure you’ve got the highest octane fuel you can get in there for the track. Add some booster to see if that helps. Also.... learn how to use the chiller to get your IC coolant temps down before a pass. If your IAT goes beyond a set point during your run.... back comes the timing and your mph will be less that it could be. Success at the track is not only getting a feel for the car but also understanding what’s at play and making sure it’s working for you.

Good info here! Tires are key and good fuel will keep the timing pulls at bay.

 

[DRAGRCR]

Greeting from the worlds slowest red eye.
I just took the Red I Kat back to the track (Bradenton Fl.). After having a hell of a time ( pun intended) getting the right cat replaced.
I also put on the skinny front M&H s and the Nitto 315/ 20 DR s.
My best time was 1.811 for the 60 foot and 11.256 for the 1/4 mile @123.17.
Now I see and have been witnessing a bunch of guys on the forum who are in the low 10s with supposedly box stock red eyes like mine!
Obviously I'm doing something DRASTICALLY wrong here. The car launches great then appears to bog a little between 1st and 2nd then breaks the traps at 6000 rpm in I believe 5th. I'm using all the right settings and power breaking to 2000 rpms (give or take) after a substantial burn out.
So why not me? What am I missing or doing wrong? Is it possible I just really DO have the worlds slowest red eye?
Linda has offered suggestions in the past, but there something more for others to be in the low to mid 10s with a stock red eye.
So anyone PLEASE throw an old man a bone, and share the magic of how you guys have paired a 1/2 second.

Light weight wheels and tires are very important. Not sure what front wheel you are running, but you need a Weld RTS or Billet Specialties 17X10 win lite back wheel with a Mickey Thompson 305/45R17 ET STREET R tire. Start car, immediately hit the SRT hard switch once and then select track mode on the radio display. Then toggle the stabilty/traction control to SPORT using the traction control hard switch. Press it once taking you back to default and then press it one more time to put it into SPORT traction/stability. You can verify this by looking at the display on the radio screen. Do a solid burnout with a tire pressure starting at 17 and then resetting them to 18 (or a little below 18) immediately upon returning from your run. You are looking for 17-18 hot for tire pressure but you can let them go up to 19 or so if the track is hooking. Make sure you run all the way to the finish line before lifting and put the hammer down hard and hold it there. Foot brake from 900 if the track is not that good. Yes go to 1800 - 2000 if the track is on point and it will pick up in the 60 foot.

The RedEye is a different animal because of the FCA programming. You MUST run in Track Mode to get the Power chiller, but then you get the track suspension along with the Chiller which is bad for drag racing. So you MUST have your act together as far as the Hook. If you have a consistently bad track prep I would suggest the 315/50R17 ET STREET R, but the 305's will be faster.

If you really think the car has learned some bad habbits I would disconnect both battery cables and touch them together for 60 seconds. Then start car and let it run for 30 seconds and turn it off. Re start car and you are good to go. I don't think you need to do this but it might be worth a try.

 

[moparjim]

You need a vacation from that cold. Come on down!

I so want to. I don't think I can pull it off though.🙁

 

[bill conner]

Launch from idle. You’re blasting the tires off which is why you’re cutting a 1.8 instead of a low 1.6 or 1.5. Your trap speed makes me think that the wheel spin is causing the traction control to kick on - or something - because you should be 5-6mph faster than that, and that could be the bogging sensation you’re experiencing because supercharged HEMIs DONT BOG!
Your 1/8mi probably a 7.2@96 or thereabouts?

You have a 315 Nitto on a 20” wheel, but how wide is your wheel? If it isn’t 11-12”, that’s not helping - even at just 20psi. You’re better off on a 275 than a 315 on a stock wheel, unless it’s a widebody, then a 305 would suffice I think.
Anyway, launch from idle with some throttle tip-in before WOT and before 2nd gear, and those 2 things alone will get you 10s.

Wow, thanks for this MOST helpful!!!! My car is a wide body and I am running 11 inch wheels. I checked the contact patch and it appeared to cover the entire tire surface @ 20 pounds.
You are right on the money my 1/8 was 7.29 @ 99.52. I am not using launch control ( at least not on purpose lol) It is possible that the bogging was tire spin. My buddy said there was no tire smoke on launch or the shift to 2nd, and it didn't look like it broke loose but he really might not have been able to tell where he was. I'm definitely goin to try the idle launch without the preload.
Am I correct in Not using launch control?

 

[bill conner]

Good morning Bill,

Your 60 ft tells the story the bogging you are feeling between 1st and 2nd is wheel spin. The Trans shifts through the gears pretty quick.

I have seen the Redeye can run an ET of 10.8.that should be doable. I have an HC Charger and my best OEM ET was a 10.8. I was lucky back then my husband (RIP) took me to the track quite often.
Lucky you the Redeye has a line lock!
Nittos love a BIG ole smokey burnout. They love to be heated. A good PSI to start at is 20. IF you are not hooking go down one or up 1 psi at a time.

Do you have 309 or 262 gears?

Trans in Track mode
Paddles off you want to have the Trans shift on it's own......you probably know that
Traction in Track
Suspension in Street this helps enabling the transfer of weight to the rear, helps with the "Squat" The rear is literally a PITA ( Pain In The A$$)
Traction switch it to track mode. This leaves stability control on.

Staging Just flicker the the Double bulb on.

Now launching is back to the PITA Rear and takes finessing

Try bringing the RPMs up to about 1000 just enough to know the fuel is there.
This is the part that is hard not to over think. So practice in your mind to make it easier.
You have your RPMS Up you will Launch probably when you see the last Orange light then the Finessing.

Its a Tap and smash to the floor. The Tap part is where the hooking happens and the gear will shift the smashing will get your 60 ft down.
This takes seat time.

Go to the Track Rental for sure you will have a BLAST!

Linda

I'm using exactly what you are recommending, with exception of the tap.
I'll try to master that technique. O and I ordered the 3.09s so I could use the 20 inch rims.
Perhaps I need to try going to 17s with the shorter control arms?

 

[Linda's Hell Cat]

I have 309 gears on my HC Charger 1 st one to have them a gift from my Husband Top Cat/ John (RIP)
I also run HHPs Ultralite 18 inch wheels by Bogart.

I have read many people going to 17s and have much success.
These are the sway bar end links I have on my HC.
https://highhorseperformance.com/hh...-17-to-18-drag-wheels-with-factory-sway-bars/

I now have the HHP Drag Springs, which are like the Demon and I'm pretty sure the Redeyes have them too.
This really helps with the Transfer of weight.

For a while lots of guys ditched there 309s and went back to the 262 gears.
But many of the same guys are now going back to the 309s with some added suspension parts.

Back in 2015 there were not a lot of aftermarket parts. Through my Husbands Love of R&D along with Josh@HHP we were at the track T&T R&D of parts and Diablo Tuning 3Xs a week.

The Demon at that time was being built and they had the 309 gears.

When the tap smash works right you will feel the Gs in your chest

Linda

 

[bill conner]

You’re getting some good info to consider. Hellcats have always had a problem getting off the line at the track. It’s the nature of the beast. That’s why we’ve all suffered thru the Utube videos of them getting beat by every underpowered POS you can imagine. A lot of that is inexperienced drivers that don’t understand what they need to do. The other part just comes down to tires that are not capable of doing the job. That will include any tire on a 20” wheel. The mid to low 10 second passes you are seeing are usually getting done with a more serious drag tire like the M/T-R drag radial on a 17 or 18 inch wheel. Put some of those on there and you’ll knock .3 seconds off that 60 ft. That will be worth 4 to 5 tenths at the end of the track. Another thing.... your mph is down. The most likely reason for that is the computer is pulling timing. There are a number of things that can cause that. Your PCM is a nanny. She is watching over everything and will do what is necessary to keep all the parts safe. If your fuel is a little low on octane, back comes the timing. Make sure you’ve got the highest octane fuel you can get in there for the track. Add some booster to see if that helps. Also.... learn how to use the chiller to get your IC coolant temps down before a pass. If your IAT goes beyond a set point during your run.... back comes the timing and your mph will be less that it could be. Success at the track is not only getting a feel for the car but also understanding what’s at play and making sure it’s working for you.

That sure makes a lot of sense! All great advice!
This is all new to me as we didn't have computers back in the 70s. I never consider the PCM would change the timing during a run. I have been using shell 93 octane exclusively as it's the highest available here. I'll definitely try some octane booster, maybe purchase some race fuel at the track.
So what is the deal with the precooling? Are you supposed to turn on the air after a run to dump cold air into the chiller? Like I said I don't really have a clue.
I considered buying the 17 inch rims initially but was afraid the required shorter control arms would void the warranty , and the on line articles showed the car doing 108s on 20 inch street tires with the 3.09 gears.
I am turning 6000 in 5th at the traps. So I thought the 315 /20 would at least get me in the 10s.
I really, REALLY appreciate your advice! I was beginning to doubt both myself and the car.

 

[Linda's Hell Cat]

VP has a good Octane Booster
https://vpracingfuels.com/product/octanium-unleaded/?c=207

Also adding a gallon or 2 of MS109 to your 93 can also be used especially on Hot days.

Linda

 

[bill conner]

I have 309 gears on my HC Charger 1 st one to have them a gift from my Husband Top Cat/ John (RIP)
I also run HHPs Ultralite 18 inch wheels by Bogart.

I have read many people going to 17s and have much success.
These are the sway bar end links I have on my HC.
https://highhorseperformance.com/hh...-17-to-18-drag-wheels-with-factory-sway-bars/

I now have the HHP Drag Springs, which are like the Demon and I'm pretty sure the Redeyes have them too.
This really helps with the Transfer of weight.

For a while lots of guys ditched there 309s and went back to the 262 gears.
But many of the same guys are now going back to the 309s with some added suspension parts.

Back in 2015 there were not a lot of aftermarket parts. Through my Husbands Love of R&D along with Josh@HHP we were at the track T&T R&D of parts and Diablo Tuning 3Xs a week.

The Demon at that time was being built and they had the 309 gears.

When the tap smash works right you will feel the Gs in your chest

Linda

As always very much appreciated advice. Bill

 

[bill conner]

Light weight wheels and tires are very important. Not sure what front wheel you are running, but you need a Weld RTS or Billet Specialties 17X10 win lite back wheel with a Mickey Thompson 305/45R17 ET STREET R tire. Start car, immediately hit the SRT hard switch once and then select track mode on the radio display. Then toggle the stabilty/traction control to SPORT using the traction control hard switch. Press it once taking you back to default and then press it one more time to put it into SPORT traction/stability. You can verify this by looking at the display on the radio screen. Do a solid burnout with a tire pressure starting at 17 and then resetting them to 18 (or a little below 18) immediately upon returning from your run. You are looking for 17-18 hot for tire pressure but you can let them go up to 19 or so if the track is hooking. Make sure you run all the way to the finish line before lifting and put the hammer down hard and hold it there. Foot brake from 900 if the track is not that good. Yes go to 1800 - 2000 if the track is on point and it will pick up in the 60 foot.

The RedEye is a different animal because of the FCA programming. You MUST run in Track Mode to get the Power chiller, but then you get the track suspension along with the Chiller which is bad for drag racing. So you MUST have your act together as far as the Hook. If you have a consistently bad track prep I would suggest the 315/50R17 ET STREET R, but the 305's will be faster.

If you really think the car has learned some bad habbits I would disconnect both battery cables and touch them together for 60 seconds. Then start car and let it run for 30 seconds and turn it off. Re start car and you are good to go. I don't think you need to do this but it might be worth a try.

Have you heard of pulling the # 31 fuse to reset the PCM, after driving on the street in 797 mode? Is that the same as disconnecting the battery cables.
I guess I'll start saving for new tires and rims LOL.

 

[bill conner]

Sign up for Marc Heidings’ private track rental at Bradenton next Saturday and Sunday. I’ll be there and I know several other Demons and Hellcats will be there too. Most have a good history of racing and will be happy to help. It’s $200/day to attend the private rental.

Thanks I'll try to make it. Do I contract the track directly?

You don't have the slowest Redeye....

Your Redeye has the slowest driver!!

LOL

You may be right.

 

[Linda's Hell Cat]

Have you heard of pulling the # 31 fuse to reset the PCM, after driving on the street in 797 mode? Is that the same as disconnecting the battery cables.
I guess I'll start saving for new tires and rims LOL.

I have heard if you pull in the engine box #31 fuse it resets the adaptive memory cycle or PCM.

This is where it learns your driving habits.
I didn't know back then but I would say to people as I got more seat time my Hellcat seemed to remember and my ET would get better.

I would imagine if you did this with your Redeye now that you are more use to it things may get better.

Linda

 

[Marc W]

That sure makes a lot of sense! All great advice!
This is all new to me as we didn't have computers back in the 70s. I never consider the PCM would change the timing during a run. I have been using shell 93 octane exclusively as it's the highest available here. I'll definitely try some octane booster, maybe purchase some race fuel at the track.
So what is the deal with the precooling? Are you supposed to turn on the air after a run to dump cold air into the chiller? Like I said I don't really have a clue.
I considered buying the 17 inch rims initially but was afraid the required shorter control arms would void the warranty , and the on line articles showed the car doing 108s on 20 inch street tires with the 3.09 gears.
I am turning 6000 in 5th at the traps. So I thought the 315 /20 would at least get me in the 10s.
I really, REALLY appreciate your advice! I was beginning to doubt both myself and the car.

Don’t doubt the car. There are a lot of variables in play and the more you learn, the better you’ll understand what is going on. DA plays a huge part in performance. A lot of the good times you are seeing are being run at low density altitude. The times you’ll see when the DA is higher are significantly slower. The starting line is a big factor. It’s amazing how lousy traction can be on a drag strip. There are times with proper prep, you can’t walk across the line without pulling your shoes off. Other times you can’t hook no matter what you do. The 17” wheel is the best choice for starting line performance. You do not have to change the rear sway bar to run those. Depending on the wheel you may need to change the sway bar end links. Those are the short little connector rods at each end of the sway bar. Doing that will not void your warranty. The 305 M/T-R will work with either the 2.62 or 3.09 gearing. I would suggest trying it with the 2.62 (if that’s what you have in there) first. The bigger 315 tire is going to absolutely require the 3.09 gear and the downside is you will have to beat the inside of your wheel well to make it fit. Many here have done that and it’s a big so what, but you’re just getting started so I would suggest the 305’s first.

 

[DRAGRCR]

Have you heard of pulling the # 31 fuse to reset the PCM, after driving on the street in 797 mode? Is that the same as disconnecting the battery cables.
I guess I'll start saving for new tires and rims LOL.

I think that is just the PCM. I also think there are capacitors that retain the long term learned data. I don't think you need to do this yet.

The 3.09's will just make your problem worse. U N L E S S you get new back wheels and better tires (ET STREET R's). The 17X10's do not need shorter sway bar end links on a wide body. You do not need octane booster. I highly doubt you will be able to tell if it is helping you or not.

Re Read what I wrote you. As far as I can tell the biggest improvements are going to be the back wheels/tires and using the power chiller.

You are confusing the Power Chiller with the After run cooldown system. The Power chiller uses the Air Conditioning to cool the intercooler loop with Freon when the car is running and ONLY in track mode. It is automatically enabled any time the car is in Track Mode. I don't think you realize how much this will help.

Also you need to take everything out of the car. Weight does matter. I would run the gas tank at about 1/3 full. Maybe even try a little less.

 

[DRAGRCR]

Have you heard of pulling the # 31 fuse to reset the PCM, after driving on the street in 797 mode? Is that the same as disconnecting the battery cables.
I guess I'll start saving for new tires and rims LOL.

FIRST CHOICE:
http://www.billetspecialties.com/wheels/win-lite/win-lite-17x10-dodge-wide-body-rear-wheel/

SECOND CHOICE
https://www.hellcat.org/threads/weld-rts-s71b-17x10-5-5-back-space-low-pad-fits.191713/

 

[DRAGRCR]

Thanks I'll try to make it. Do I contract the track directly?


You may be right.

https://www.facebook.com/marc.heidi...dti=2380653158834799&hc_location=group_dialog

 

[TNREDEYE]

A few quick details about how I run my Wide Body Redeye..

1 - I've had 17x10 and 17x11 Wheels on my car. Neither requires shorter end links.

2 - I've run the 315 tire on my 17x11 Welds and have LOTS of clearance in all directions. No hammer required, just bolt them on.

3 - I have tried unleaded race fuel, octane boosters as well as small amounts of E90. To date my quickest runs have been made w straight 93 octane right out of the pump.

4 - I've tried many different settings and have found that the factory TRACK setting produces the quickest runs.

I've been 10.50's in slower conditions than you will see in Bradenton with nothing but the rear wheel swap.

IMO, buy yourself a set of 17's w the MT ET R, learn to do a good burnout and you'll be way into the 10's in no time.

Good luck and have fun!!

 

[DRAGRCR]

A few quick details about how I run my Wide Body Redeye..

1 - I've had 17x10 and 17x11 Wheels on my car. Neither requires shorter end links.

2 - I've run the 315 tire on my 17x11 Welds and have LOTS of clearance in all directions. No hammer required, just bolt them on.

3 - I have tried unleaded race fuel, octane boosters as well as small amounts of E90. To date my quickest runs have been made w straight 93 octane right out of the pump.

4 - I've tried many different settings and have found that the factory TRACK setting produces the quickest runs.

I've been 10.50's in slower conditions than you will see in Bradenton with nothing but the rear wheel swap.

IMO, buy yourself a set of 17's w the MT ET R, learn to do a good burnout and you'll be way into the 10's in no time.

Good luck and have fun!!

E X A C T L Y !

 

[Phast Hemi]

Lots of good points here. Redeyes will go 10.4s right out of the box with nothing more than rear wheels and tires= with both the 2.62 and 3.09 gear ( I have tested both). My first pass in one of these cars was a 10.43(+1500 DA) backed up with a 10.42 on nothing more than a 30/45/17 radial. Feel free to inbox me if you need more help. Thanks

 

[Demon1]

Thanks I'll try to make it. Do I contract the track directly?


You may be right.

Send a personal message to Marc (Marc0779) on the forum here. I believe he set it up as a private rental. I paid Marc thru PayPal. @Marc0779